Zodiac identified... :D

Zodiac stuff that doesn't seem to fit anyplace else

Re: Zodiac identified... :D

Postby sandy betts » Mon Apr 03, 2017 12:28 pm

the ghost of zodiac wrote:Very interesting thread on Zodiac's first name Paul

I do think Darlene may have dealt drugs to Zodiac (among other things) and he became enraged when he found her in a parked car with another man..

I believe Darlene's killer was probably the same man reportedly seen in the apt parking lot with Donna Lass in 1970.

Was Darlene killed by Zodiac because she could identify him in previous murder?

Darlene is suspected of selling drugs and Donna Lass worked as a nurse at SFrans, Letterman hospital and had access to strong painkillers

just food for thought
TGOZ



Darlene wasn't just "suspected" of selling drugs, she did sell them. I was told by one of her friends who bought them from her.

TGOZ, you are not the first person who has mentioned drugs being a part of the Zodiac case. Someone "hinted" that some of the drugs came from Vallejo Kaiser hospital. I totally agree with you , that Darlene saw Zodiac kill someone and that was reason enough for her to be eliminated.But I also believe that she was connected to him through the drugs and counterfeit money she was laundering for his group. It seems that after buying her home, she waned out of that dangerous group.
I am pretty sure that she was about to tell the authorities something and that was why she told her mother, that she would be reading about her in the newspaper. I believe it was about the crime group or the murder she saw, or both. Maybe she threatened Zodiac to leave her alone or she would tell? I know for sure that the group killed who they felt were snitches. From what I was told Tony Anstey was one of those people.
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Re: Zodiac identified... :D

Postby Quicktrader » Wed Apr 05, 2017 6:23 am

Uhhm...nice idea...let's assume for a second that Z had killed Darlene because she wanted to come out with some information. I think it is more likely that Dee had witnessed Betty Lou's murder instead of CJB's, but anyway.

When Darlene had told her mother about her intentions, her killer must have gotten knowledge about these intentions somehow.

This most likely had happened just a day before her murder (or a short time before it). A killer would rather not wait a long time to make his victim silent, I guess. Thus there are two possibilities..one is that her mother had talked to someone about Darlene's plans (or someone was present when Dee and her mother had talked about it) or Dee had talked to someone else (potentially a person knowing the killer). As far as I know, Dee had talked to her mother at home. As she had talked to Pam earlier, warning about the man.

According to Pam, Darlene warned that she had witnessed a murder and that the murderer had been following her. Pam suspected that Darlene may have been involved in a satanic cult. Both Pam and Linda claimed they had attended a painting party in Darlene’s home, and that they had seen an unidentified man who arrived wearing a suit. Darlene was reportedly afraid of this man and warned Pam to stay away from him because, “She said he was a bad man... She’d seen him kill somebody.”
http://www.zodiackillerfacts.com/forum/ ... f=19&t=675

Some questions arise:

- Who was present when Dee had talked to her mother? (Pam)
- Who was present when Dee had warned Pam about the man? To might Pam have talked?
- To whom else may Dee have talked about her intentions?

Facing reality, the killer wasn't warned by Darlene talking to her mom (or her sister) but was already on her tracks when arriving at the painting party. It might be assumed that it was him as Darlene had told her sister that the guy had killed someone. Thus, Z was already after her when meeting her at the party. It is obvious that Z was not able to kill her during the party without having multiple witnesses. But he did kill her afterwards.

If we get that one into a focus, Z must have known some things:

1. Z did know where Darlene had been living (stalking, presents)
2. Z did know about the 'painting' party and the fact that Darlene would be there (at her home)
3. Z did know about her having witnessed his murder (of either Betty Lou and David or CJB some years earlier)

HOWEVER: There is a problem with the timeline..

12-20-1968 Jensen/Faraday homicide
05-24-1969 Painting party
07-04-1969 Ferrin homicide

IF Z had wanted to kill Darlene as soon as possible (to prevent her from talking), he could have done so shortly after the painting party, e.g. on the next day. Obviously he did not. Although being at the painting party, most likely because of her, he had waited over a month (!) before killing her.

That is, what I say, weird. If Z had known Darlene, he did not kill her although he might have known that she had witnessed him murdering somebody.

He therefore either was at the party accidentially (I don't think so) or it was only later that he had known about Darlene having some information about him being a killer. But then again: Why was he at the party?? It simply doesn't match..

What is a match, however, is that he potentially had made various presents to Darlene and stalked her since he had known about her knowledge. Darlene either didn't enjoy that or (bad version) even black-mailed him with the information she actually had. Z couldn't stand such situation any longer, Darlene then even talks about going to inform the media and - BANG goes the shot.

We should be aware that he did so only after Darlene had talked to her mother, not earlier. From that day on, her killer had seen no other choice except to make her silent. All this after 'waiting' for over a month since the painting party, if not years (in case of Darlene witnessing the murder of CJB).


My conclusion is that either Darlene, her mom, her dad or Pam had talked to at least one person knowing Z or even Z himself.

One might further conclude that those two persons must have met in a timeframe approximately 24 hours before the murder. To be precise such a meeting must have happened between the time of Darlene talking to her mother about her intentions and the homicide of Darlene Ferrin itself. Some people might have talked about Darlene's intentions:

a.) If Darlene had talked to Z about she must have either been crazy or simply black-mailing him.
b.) Pam had known about him being a killer, thus nothing new about that from her side, except that she might have talked directly to Z informing him about what Darlene had said.
c.) Darlene's mother had little if any ties at all to Darlene's stalker, except she had known him as a lover?
d.) Mike Mageau appears to have no idea about the guy who had stalked Darlene.
e.) Painting party guests talking about Darlene's intentions may be ruled out as a releasing cause as the party had happened weeks earlier.
f.) Dad theory: What if Darlene's dad had learned about Darlene's intentions from her mother and then took her stalker to task? He also would have known about that one..

Darlene black-mailing a known killer? That girls must have had guts.
Pam talking to her sister's stalker? Not very likely either.
Darlene's mother having a relationship with Z? Nice idea but then Darlene would have known about, I guess.
Mike Mageau not telling the truth? Why should he, if being shot by such a guy.
Dad not talking about his spare time shortly before his daughter's murder? Not so likely either.

All of this appears to be nonsense. What I try to figure out, however, is the way of communication the causing moment had made. The one that made Z make his decision to kill Darlene NOW. To follow her and shoot both of them as hard as he could. Not to forget: He could have killed her earlier (if being the stalker and/or the painting party guest), but he did not.

The causing moment, for 99.9%, was the information that Darlene had the INTENTION to publish information abouth the homicide she had witnessed.

The central question is: How did that information get to Zodiac, if not by Darlene herself.

My best guess is that Darlene had talked to someone about her intentions and that this person was either Z himself (black-mailing theory) or someone who actually had known/informed Z about her intentions. It therefore might be very useful to figure out, if possible, what Darlene had done between talking to her mother about her intentions to make all this public and her murder itself.

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Re: Zodiac identified... :D

Postby sandy betts » Wed Apr 05, 2017 10:24 am

It could be as simple as the argument Darlene had in the parking lot at Terry's minutes before she was killed. What ever that was about, could have been the icing on the cake so to speak.
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Re: Zodiac identified... :D

Postby Quicktrader » Wed Apr 05, 2017 10:32 am

sandy betts wrote:It could be as simple as the argument Darlene had in the parking lot at Terry's minutes before she was killed. What ever that was about, could have been the icing on the cake so to speak.


Correct..do we know with whom she was there? Assuming she had argued with or about Z, was there anybody else watching the argument? Her sister Christina?

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Re: Zodiac identified... :D

Postby sandy betts » Wed Apr 05, 2017 11:04 am

Yes it was Chris, she believed the guy was Larry Kane ( Because the guy looked very much like Kane). She knows Kane has died, so now she feels Darlene's killer is dead. That is something she said to one of my guy friends this past year, who was her neighbor in another state.
My suspect just happens to look like Kane, he is still alive.

As far as I am concerned , Darlene's killer is very much alive!
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Re: Zodiac identified... :D

Postby bigbuckdownnc » Sun May 14, 2017 7:38 pm

I am not sure I believe this is a Z communication but it's an interesting riddle. The last name of Jacques fits nicely into the riddle. (I am athletic, "jocks"....swim gear etc). So something like Paul St Jacques or Jacques St Paul fits really well based on the riddle.
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Re: Zodiac identified... :D

Postby sandy betts » Mon May 15, 2017 11:28 pm

I am sorry, maybe I am just getting too old to understand some of the posts, what riddle???????? That makes about as much sense to me as a clue to Jock itch fitting the Zodiac.
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Re: Zodiac identified... :D

Postby Mr lowe » Tue May 16, 2017 4:43 am

JULY 19, 1978 Letter - I Am In Control of All Things
Postby Bently » Tue Feb 09, 2010 9:14 am

This letter contains an interesting riddle. Does not contain the usual "This is the Zodiac speaking". Mailed from LA to the Chronicle, typewritten, no envelope image published.

http://zodiackillertruth.com/control.htm

I am the ZODIAC and I am in control of all things. I am going to tell you a secret. I like friction tape. I like to have it around in case I need to truss someone up in a hurry....I have my real name on a small metallic tape. You see, while you have it in your possession, I want you to know it belongs to me and you think I may have left it accidentally. I am athletic. It could be swim fins, or a piece of scuba gear. But maybe you play chess with me. I have several cheap sets in closets all over. I have my name on the bottom of the lid with the scotch tape....My tape is waiting for me all over California. Do you know me? I am the ZODIAC and I am in control.

i think its about this
A killer we sort stood there among the dead
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Re: Zodiac identified... :D

Postby bigbuckdownnc » Tue May 16, 2017 7:03 am

sandy betts wrote:I am sorry, maybe I am just getting too old to understand some of the posts, what riddle???????? That makes about as much sense to me as a clue to Jock itch fitting the Zodiac.


Sandy, I was reading through this the other day and found it interesting. Quicktrader created a thread that ran through some scenarios of Zs first name being Paul based on the riddle. I was just simply saying that the last name of St Jacques fits nicely into the rest.

One of the first famous chess players was named Paul. Jacques could be a play on words for jocks, meaning athletic. And I am pretty sure Cousteau had a lot to do with scuba diving.

Like I said, just a thought based on what is probably a worthless riddle.
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Re: Zodiac identified... :D

Postby sandy betts » Tue May 16, 2017 12:02 pm

Ok, I looked for the riddle didn't find it. The name Paul was a name I gave to VPD back in 1970 as a possible suspect.
That is in Darlene's police report, but he had a alibi for July 4th 69 and was no longer a suspect. That is the only Paul I am familiar with.

I think that if you are posting about something from another thread, it would help people like me, if you either give a link to what you are posting about or do it using a quote.I don't read every post I just don't have the time, so unless there is something like a quote to the subject, I am lost.

Myself I would be looking for older men with the first name starting with R and last name starting with H, who perhaps once lived or worked in southern Ca. and moved to or worked in Vallejo at least by 1968. I have gone over some of the unsolved cypher's and found the name Robert more than once with a last name starting with H. I truly believe that the RH at the bottom of the desk top poem in Riverside, was a huge mistake made by Zodiac that couldn't be erased. Lucky for him RH has been ignored by many as being a blood type? For me it is the best clue to finding Zodiac other than his DNA.
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